Is RED an asset or gimmick?

Sharon · February 01, 2006, 05:05:22 PM

Why not, we wont tell

mclem07 · April 19, 2007, 11:09:38 PM

I can't tell a difference in the amount I catch using the red hooks or normal hooks. I just bought a pack about a week ago.. but no difference in my eyes.

GotstaFish · April 19, 2007, 11:28:55 PM

Oh Man, Looks like we are opening up this ole can-o-worms again

mattorschell · April 19, 2007, 11:59:40 PM

I went to a siminar that scott rook was putting on and he said he did a test with his crankbaits and 90% of the time the red hook is what they were on, that is why he only puts a red hook on the front becouse he would reather them bite the front hook, he said he was not coinvinced on his plastics yet.

clubber · April 20, 2007, 12:08:14 AM

Wow, is this one back again? Sorry but it was a gimmick when this thread started and still is.....

GotstaFish · April 20, 2007, 12:09:49 AM

Quote from: clubber on April 20, 2007, 12:08:14 AM
Wow, is this one back again? Sorry but it was a gimmick when this thread started and still is.....

I agree but don't tell anyone I said so

Dug · April 20, 2007, 05:14:33 AM

So it's not surprising that it comes up again. It's an interesting question. I can't say without a doubt that it works or doesn't. I use red hooks, they don't cost me anymore than bronze, grey black or even green hooks, and to me they SEEM to work better. Can't speak about the red line though, never tried it.

I know it seems like we are beating a dead horse, but newer members have the right to discovery, just like we did in the past.
Dug

mlakrid · April 20, 2007, 06:26:23 AM

Quote from: GotstaFish on April 20, 2007, 12:09:49 AM
I agree but don't tell anyone I said so

I wont tell anyone either Karl...

So why do you have your craw colored jigs again???

OH thats RIGHT...

they are the same color as REAL crawdads... and they work, hmm who woulda thunk it?

If it looks real in shape and color to the forage in the area you WILL catch more fish than those using lure which dont match the hatch at the same area...

I DO NOT think this is a gimmic... there are several studies which show bass can see in limited colors... why should we doubt scientific proof?

EDIT: adding information directly taken from wikipedia who has MANY multiple references:
Senses
Lateral Line: The Lateral Line is a series of pores located alongside the bass. This set of pores is used to detect vibrations in the water. This is sensitive enough to detect the speed, size, and shape of another fish.

Sight: Largemouth bass have color vision and they mostly use their sight in clear water. However, in low visibility conditions bass do not use their sight as much as their sense of vibration though their lateral line or their sense of smell. Depending on water clarity, largemouth bass can see anywhere from 100 feet to 5 feet.

Hearing: Bass have ears located inside of their skull. However, because sound travels through water much better than air a bass has a very keen sense of hearing.

Smell: Bass use smell to detect prey or predators. Their smell is very sensitive and if they smell a predator nearby they will swim away from the area.

Mike A
Land O Lakes, FL

GotstaFish · April 20, 2007, 04:53:51 PM

Quote from: mlakrid on April 20, 2007, 06:26:23 AM
I wont tell anyone either Karl...

So why do you have your craw colored jigs again???

OH thats RIGHT... they are the same color as REAL crawdads... and they work, hmm who woulda thunk it?

If it looks real in shape and color to the forage in the area you WILL catch more fish than those using lure which dont match the hatch at the same area...

I DO NOT think this is a gimmic... there are several studies which show bass can see in limited colors... why should we doubt scientific proof?

Nobody said a bass can't see in color. (I can't believe I'm doing this again

) All I know is the "Red" theory takes on 2 completely different sides. One says a bass can see the red hooks and strikes and the other says that their red line disappears so the bass doesn't see the line. In my "Opinion" I think for one, red hooks are junk, they bend way too easy. Two, I have tried them and have had no difference in the results as far as having bass hit the red hook more than a bronze hook.
Now, as far as your statement.

QuoteSo why do you have your craw colored jigs again???

OH thats RIGHT... they are the same color as REAL crawdads... and they work, hmm who woulda thunk it?

Are you serious? Comparing a natural crawdad to a hook? I don't see the relevance in that one. Tell me what in nature has red hooks sticking out of it and I'll buy what your trying to sell here.

Making a lure imitate the surrounding forage is one thing, but to say if I don't believe in the red hook theory why do I worry about lure color is ridiculous. Of course I want my lure to imitate the food source, doesn't everyone?
Now who woulda thunk it? Answer, everyone, its no secret.

GRAPEAPE · April 20, 2007, 08:28:11 PM

Looks like a hot topic so i thought I would put my 2 cents in.
I have personally never noticed a difference one way or the other with the red thing. I have fished the clear lakes of the boundry waters, and the clear lakes of TN, as well as the murky waters around the midwest. Nearest I can tell it's a wash. I am a natural color kinda guy, however I don't think the red hurts. When selecting new tackle if it has red hooks then so be it. I am not looking for that specifically but if they are already on it then no big deal to me. I look more for vibration, and baitfish color match than I am hook color. So for me if it's already on their fine if it's not fine. If it doesn't help that's ok I still manage to catch fish, if it does help then bonus.
MHO

Grape

-Shawn- · April 22, 2007, 02:09:47 AM

OK this is just my 2 cents, If anyone doesnt beleive this you can try it for yourself. As far as the red line it is just as visible at 30ft of depth as it is at 1 ft. I have gone diving and experimented with it. Now it is true that the farther you get away from the line it does disapear. However I havent seen a bass that can eat a lure from 4 ft away. Light refraction has to do with distance from the color under water, not depth that the color is under the water. It was a gimic and still is a gimic. this is very easy to see for yourself if you dont beleive me. Get a mask and go in the water and I promise you I know what result you will come back with. Like I said before put the line 1 foot from your face in 30ft of water and it will be just as visible as it is on the surface. I just hate to see these gimics come along to take our money. Dont take my word for get in the water and seee for yourself. Now take the money that you would spend on the red line and lets go have a

.

GotstaFish · April 22, 2007, 10:31:35 AM

Quote from: shawnrg33 on April 22, 2007, 02:09:47 AM
OK this is just my 2 cents, If anyone doesnt beleive this you can try it for yourself. As far as the red line it is just as visible at 30ft of depth as it is at 1 ft. I have gone diving and experimented with it. Now it is true that the farther you get away from the line it does disapear. However I havent seen a bass that can eat a lure from 4 ft away. Light refraction has to do with distance from the color under water, not depth that the color is under the water. It was a gimic and still is a gimic. this is very easy to see for yourself if you dont beleive me. Get a mask and go in the water and I promise you I know what result you will come back with. Like I said before put the line 1 foot from your face in 30ft of water and it will be just as visible as it is on the surface. I just hate to see these gimics come along to take our money. Dont take my word for get in the water and seee for yourself. Now take the money that you would spend on the red line and lets go have a .

You should work with "MYTH BUSTERS"

-Shawn- · April 22, 2007, 10:39:27 AM

Quote from: GotstaFish on April 22, 2007, 10:31:35 AM
You should work with "MYTH BUSTERS"

You think they would want to sponsor a stiky old bass fisherman?

I am pretty sure Cajun line doesnt want to sponsor me now.

coldfront · April 22, 2007, 01:38:45 PM

Quote from: Fishaholic on February 01, 2006, 07:05:24 AM
If my memory serves me correctly, red doesn't actually disappear...it becomes a shade of grey, but for that matter...do fish actually see colors, or just shades of grey like so many other animals?

Fish do see color...what we don't know for sure is whether or not they perceive it like we do...what I suspect is that we are guilty of anthropromorphism (ascribing human responses to animals) because that's the way we think...kind of like, I can learn Spanish or French or German, but my thought process would continue to be in English...

I don't think the red line disappears...but that's me...and then too, there's the issue of the lateral line (another sense fish use to 'see' underwater)...
Finally, when putting a red hook on the front position of crankbaits, it seems anecdotally confirmed that a greater number of fish strike the front trebal...they 'see' something different...

I remember (or think I do) an In-fisherman article once that tacked the topic of 'what fish see' and I think I recall they said that bass were able to 'see' stuff at up to 25 feet in muddy water...if I remember correctly and I'm old enough now that this may not be true...further, of course they didn't describe the conditions or controls of the experiment, so I'm only assuming they rigged it to filter out the impact of the lateral lines...

Interesting topic for sure...just wish they'd respect fishermen's intelligence enough to put some of the important stuff in the articles....even if it were only the 'reference' section at the end of said article...

-Shawn- · April 22, 2007, 03:59:04 PM

I have always been a skeptic and try to confirm or bus these gimics if I can. The line gimic is easy for anyone to bust. these companies bank on the fact you will take there word for there products. But like I said color refraction has to do with distance the color travels through the water and not depth from the surface. I have never heard of any one being able to hook a fish from 4 ft away from the lure and that is the distance you have to be from the line for it to disapear.

bass1cpr · April 22, 2007, 08:09:17 PM

If red's a gimic just give me all of your red lure's (Rayburn red Rattle Traps) and any other red crankbaits you wasted your money on.

GotstaFish · April 22, 2007, 08:17:42 PM

Quote from: bass1cpr on April 22, 2007, 08:09:17 PM
If red's a gimic just give me all of your red lure's (Rayburn red Rattle Traps) and any other red crankbaits you wasted your money on.

Red hooks, not crawfish painted crankbaits. Big difference.

-Shawn- · April 22, 2007, 08:19:24 PM

Quote from: bass1cpr on April 22, 2007, 08:09:17 PM
If red's a gimic just give me all of your red lure's (Rayburn red Rattle Traps) and any other red crankbaits you wasted your money on.

The red line is a gimmic, As far as the bleeding baits, I feel like what ever color the fish see the blood from a baitfish, it is the same color they see the red on a bleeding bait as. whether it is red or blue or pink or purple or gray. what ever color it is it looks like blood to the fish. So I will keep my red baits.

bassnman30 · April 23, 2007, 04:01:07 PM

OK, heres what I think. A person can see the red in fishing lines. But light passes through and "may" disappear in water. However, red hooks are a solid feature and therefore a fish can see the hooks. $:-\$

clubber · April 23, 2007, 04:57:27 PM

I'm gonna get me some of them red hooks and some of that red line. Heck, I'm even going to paint my rod and reel red. Maybe even my green truck. Can't miss then, should win every tournament I have this year.

bass1cpr · April 24, 2007, 07:54:10 AM

Never tried red line never intended to never will. Red Treble Hooks I love em.

Hey Gotstafish, Red is Red is Red

GotstaFish · April 24, 2007, 08:49:09 AM

Quote from: bass1cpr on April 24, 2007, 07:54:10 AM
Never tried red line never intended to never will. Red Treble Hooks I love em.

Hey Gotstafish, Red is Red is Red

Yes it is, but, a crankbait painted to match a stage in a crawfish' life is completely different than just throwing a red hook on any old crankbait. This will be a never ending discussion because what it boils down too is what you have confidence in and if putting a red hook on the end of your line makes you feel more confident then you are going to catch more fish. On the other hand, fish against a guy who has more confidence in a pink and purple pok-a-dot hook and see what the outcome is. If red hooks were that much better and had been proven by top pro's in the industry, don't you think every lure manufacturer would be putting them on their products, I know I would. Instead. I opt for a higher quality hook and let my lure attract the fish, not the hook. In my experiance with red hooks they are more likely to straighten out on a large fish due to the material they use in order for the anodized finish to hold to them. Like I said, this is "my experiance and opinions" and I'm not trying to push them on anybody, simply stating what has happened during my use of them. If I have some lying around you are more than welcome to them, but, I'll keep my red crawfish crankbaits.

bass1cpr · April 24, 2007, 12:47:47 PM

Wow one line got all that.

I've never bought into the Red Line I figure people buy it because they like the way it looks. I was buying and using crankbaits long before the Red Hooks ever came around. My confidence is in my crankbaits. Red trebles seem to help and make a differance on baits that run to about 8 feet after that they all have black nickle hooks. Well maybe just a couple that I experimented with but that's not why I was throwing thsoe crankbaits to begin with.

Tried Red circles for drop shot didn't see any real benefit, Never bought any Red Worm Hooks either.

Mustad Ultra Points are my number one choice for plastics.

Jared LeBlue · April 24, 2007, 01:28:03 PM

Been using red line for about 8 months now and I like it. Now does it disappear or is harder for fish to see than regular mono, I don't know. I do know that I haven't found that anyone I'm fishing with that is using regular mono is getting any more bites than I am and vise versa. I like the red because I can see it above water which makes it easier to watch my line. I do find it interesting that other companies haven't jumped on the red line bandwagon. Almost all hook companies have red hooks but as far as I know Shakespear is the only company putting out a red line. Like stated above if you have confidence in it than that's all that matters. I'm sure in the near future someone will come out with some gimmick that will suck us all in as usual and we will have another thread running "is it a gimmick". Heck that's what makes and keeps this sport interesting.

GotstaFish · April 24, 2007, 03:54:26 PM

Quote from: Rattle on April 24, 2007, 01:28:03 PM
Been using red line for about 8 months now and I like it. Now does it disappear or is harder for fish to see than regular mono, I don't know. I do know that I haven't found that anyone I'm fishing with that is using regular mono is getting any more bites than I am and vise versa. I like the red because I can see it above water which makes it easier to watch my line. I do find it interesting that other companies haven't jumped on the red line bandwagon. Almost all hook companies have red hooks but as far as I know Shakespear is the only company putting out a red line. Like stated above if you have confidence in it than that's all that matters. I'm sure in the near future someone will come out with some gimmick that will suck us all in as usual and we will have another thread running "is it a gimmick". Heck that's what makes and keeps this sport interesting.

Power Pro has a red line out also.