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Author Topic: First experience with braid, mixed feelings, fun read  (Read 1664 times)

TWBryan

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Re: First experience with braid, mixed feelings, fun read
« Reply #25 on: August 11, 2017, 02:50:46 PM »

Steelhorse I appreciate the feedback on braided line.It's really the only way old fogies like me can get trusted info on the new stuff. :)

Everyone seems to distrust the heathen chinee(kastking) line. I've seen some on ebay that was listed as 8 strand. I've heard it's coarser than the stuff in stores over here ,but sturdy enough. I suspect the braided line is all made in china like everything else. The stuff in stores is a bit more refined than what they sell on ebay. ;)

I have an old abu garcia usa1 casting reel. I cleaned it all up when I went through my reel box. I suspect the quality is near bottom rung. It won't cast near as far as my swedish made ambassadeurs ,so I didn't mess further with it.

Currently have an abu 4600c4 mounted on a bps tourney rod,and a Pflueger President 6935 mounted on an old bps power pro rod. Those will be primary equipment when I start. Nearly finished getting tackle together. Not much longer now. ;) 

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SteelHorseCowboy

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Re: First experience with braid, mixed feelings, fun read
« Reply #26 on: August 11, 2017, 07:11:20 PM »

I say go for it. Like I said, it's the price that always held me back. It was just a perfect storm of sorts, everything fell into place and I got the chance to try it out on the cheap.
I would steer towards the more established brands, but you can still find that fairly cheap with a watchful eye.
My opinion, well worth it.
But, if you decide you still just can't justify the cost (I had a very hard time doing so even at the price I paid), may I recommend Sufix Pro-Mix?
I'm getting the impression you're coming back to fishing after a long hiatus just like I did. I hadn't fished regularly in a little over ten years, and I was blown away at how much the options in fishing line had changed in just that amount of time.
It's a co-polymer, I'd never even heard of copolymer before I joined the service and left the tackle at dear old mom's. It seems to be on sale just about everywhere for around $5 per spool. I've tried several monos since I got back into fishing this year. I've thrown away more cheap line this year than some people probably may buy in a decade. I found the Sufix on clearance somewhere for $2-$3, couldn't pass it up for that price, and discovered I like it much better than the P-line I'd been using.

Man, I could write a whole article on a bass newbie's adventures in looking for decent line on tight funds. That's the best real BUDGET line I've found. Good line don't get much cheaper than that, and I don't think line that cheap can possibly get any better. I looked up some reviews and discussions on other forums, and a lot of folks seem to feel it's better than Sufix's newer high end copolymers. I can't attest to that personally as I haven't compared the two, but if I'm in a situation where I no longer have braid available at a price I can afford, I've got several spools of Pro-Mix stashed and I'll probably snag a few more here and there just to have on hand.
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TWBryan

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Re: First experience with braid, mixed feelings, fun read
« Reply #27 on: August 13, 2017, 11:00:39 AM »

Steelhorse,I think the last time I went fishing was back in the '80's. So,yes,it's been a very long time for me. I feel like a noobie,still remember a few things though.

Co-polyner,fluoro carbon, and braid that's nothing like my dad used on his thumb-buster reels. Some of the new stuff seems amazing,some of it seems to be status symbols. Apparently we've entered the age of 'boutique' fishing.

I will look into the suffix pro-mix line. I use to like Trilene xl on baitcasters,it seemed to work a bit better than the Trilene xt which is widely available.

I'm afraid I have to ask,would you put braid on your 5000 or one of my 4600's? The clothes dryer defeated me,and my truck's a/c has issues,so getting a daiwa tatula next month is looking a little questionable. Also how much braid is required? I suspect I'll be going for something like 50lb test braid so the diameter will be big enough to avoid slipping over the spool and into the gears.

Thanks :)

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SteelHorseCowboy

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Re: First experience with braid, mixed feelings, fun read
« Reply #28 on: August 14, 2017, 11:44:34 AM »

I actually have either 30 or 40 lb braid on my 5000 sitting right next to me, I've had no issues at all with it. I'm not sure which really, I intended to use 30 but my spool of 40 looks a bit thinner than the 30.
What I did, using different line diameters between braid and mono (you know you'll need to tie on to a mono backing, right?), I walked approximately 100 yards of mono off my reel, tied on braid, and filled the spool from there.

If you match mono and braid diameters, the length of line you take off, should be the same as you put on. I think 50 braid is the same diameter as 16 mono? So if you're already spooled with 16 mono, you should be able to remove 100 yards mono and replace with 100 yards 50 braid.

If you're starting with an empty spool, it's only slightly more complicated. Look at the line capacity for your reel. I'd match the diameters between braid and mono when starting with an empty reel. I'd walk off however much braid you think you'll actually be using (for me, about 50 yards would be fitting), put enough mono on the reel to make up the difference, then spool on the remainder in that braid.

Starting with a full reel takes more guesswork and is less precise, which is what I did. You use more line than really necessary. I recommend starting with an empty reel.

More experienced anglers here should feel welcome to add to this or correct me.
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TWBryan

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Re: First experience with braid, mixed feelings, fun read
« Reply #29 on: August 14, 2017, 12:39:40 PM »

Steelhorse ,thanks for that it makes sense to me. I'll prob ably go that route when I get some braid. Walk a hundred yards off then tie on braid,good simple instructions for a dim-witted old fart like me.:)

Since I need to put off the tatula for a month at least I'll probably invest in some upgrade parts for the abu garcia 4600. I am pretty set on a dual bearing levelwind kit,and a little longer handle. I'm less certain about installing hybrid spool bearings. Some people say it's good,and other say the faster spool rotation leads to more backlashes.

The other thing will be polishing some of the parts. I've heard it's a good idea to polish spool axle ends and the pinion gear id.

Not sure if replacing the large gear in the sideplate with one that has a bearing is going to help or not.

Did you find a reel for your daughter?

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SteelHorseCowboy

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Re: First experience with braid, mixed feelings, fun read
« Reply #30 on: August 14, 2017, 03:38:53 PM »

I've given her the 5500C3. I did comment on your upgrade thread, I'd start with the polishing or spool bearings. Polishing in my 5000 was about perfect, upgrading to bearings (now making it a C3) was a bit much and took some practice to get used to it. I'd actually considered reverting back to the bushings, but after getting used to the faster spool and less resistance, I don't think so. May someday add a mag brake to it. It's not the initial cast to me that was the issue, it's that once my lure/bait hit the water, the spool would just keep going... and going... and going...
If it didn't all pile up on the level wind once my lure hit the water, I could probably throw out 100 yards of line on a 30 yard cast! Okay, that's an exaggeration, but you get the gist.
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TWBryan

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Re: First experience with braid, mixed feelings, fun read
« Reply #31 on: August 14, 2017, 07:33:25 PM »

Steelhorse, okay,I was going to offer one of my "less-loved" reels,but I'm glad you got her one. :)

I'll probably start polishing parts tomorrow,the bearings seem to work okay. Probably next month I'll grab one of the dual bearing levelwind kits and order a commie handle. That will be a decent start to "hot-rodding" the old reel. :)
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SteelHorseCowboy

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Re: First experience with braid, mixed feelings, fun read
« Reply #32 on: August 15, 2017, 08:47:28 AM »

Wow man, I appreciate the thought!
She'd fallen in love with my 5000, but does hate red and I ain't giving that one up anyway. She can have it when I'm dead. She didn't know I had the silver 5500C3 and I'd somewhat forgotten about it. I can't find any functional difference between the two, at all. Especially after upgrading the 5000 to a C3. Same gear ratio, same retrieve rate (I think the 5000 is a half inch less per turn), same number of bearings now, and in her second favorite color for gadgets and accessories. Her favorite is black, but my only black one is the Royal Express. I have plans for that one and she prefers the push button release rather than the thumb bar anyway.

And heck yeah man, hotrod the snot out of 'em! There's tons of aftermarket parts out there and interchangeable parts, may be tricky to find some of them though. Mike's reel repair is a good start, and if you're on facebook, check out "We who loves the Abu Ambassadeur" page. Lot of cool members there from overseas too, that may hook you up with Euro and Jap exclusive parts and whole reels.

I'm planning low speed gearing and power handle for my Frankenreel, and have several more mods and tweaks in mind for the 5000 and 4600 RE. On the RE, two definite changes will be swapping the frame for an all metal one, and the right plate with one that has the IAR clutch bearings. I'm keeping the AR dog on the Frankenreel for catfish, as I've seen clutch bearing sleeves fail catastrophically under massive catfish. Watched a thumb get dislocated that way, that was interesting.

I haven't looked into gear ratio changes for the RE, but I'm considering upgrading the speed on either it or my 5000.

I need more Ambassadeurs... and rods to put 'em on!
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SteelHorseCowboy

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Re: First experience with braid, mixed feelings, fun read
« Reply #33 on: August 15, 2017, 09:06:17 AM »

Just did some quick looking around. Looks like the RE already is a higher gearing. In my defense, I haven't really used it other than fooling around with it, and it didn't have decals.
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TWBryan

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Re: First experience with braid, mixed feelings, fun read
« Reply #34 on: August 15, 2017, 10:10:26 AM »

Steelhorse, I will probably end up selling the 5000 I have on ebay for parts,I also have a Royal Express 4600 I'm not fond of,and an old 1000 that has zinc gearing(wall-hanger). Will probably sell all of them in a package deal. I figure if it gets around $50,plus shipping it will help pay for upgrading my c4.

Went out and bought a new clothes dryer so I've definetely "downgraded" the bank account. :(

Looking at a couple 4x10x4 hybrid bearings from boca,and maybe a commie reel handle.  That should do more for the 4600 than anything else I can think of. I might also order 500m of the 8 strand braid...

Going to take it apart in a little bit and see about polishing and what parts need it.
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SteelHorseCowboy

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Re: First experience with braid, mixed feelings, fun read
« Reply #35 on: August 15, 2017, 11:16:41 AM »

What all is wrong with the 5000 and RE? Have pics?
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TWBryan

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Re: First experience with braid, mixed feelings, fun read
« Reply #36 on: August 15, 2017, 11:22:09 AM »

The 5000 I think needs parts,but can't swear that's all it needs, the Royal Express is fine,it functions great,I'm just not a fan of the graphite reel seat. I'll see if I can dig them out after a bit and take pictures. I might as well learn how to post pics. :)

Gone ahead with dual bearing levelwind kit and a longer handle from the commies. ;)
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TWBryan

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Re: First experience with braid, mixed feelings, fun read
« Reply #37 on: August 15, 2017, 12:18:30 PM »

Ok I took a few pics of the reels I want to get rid,as you can see there isn't anything special in this collection.

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SteelHorseCowboy

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Re: First experience with braid, mixed feelings, fun read
« Reply #38 on: August 15, 2017, 01:26:52 PM »

If I can spare the funds this payday, I'd love to have that 5000.
Can't make any promises though. Had to take some time off work to pick one kid up at Dallas Love airport and handle all this school registration bull crap. Doing an "out of district transfer". We live exactly 1.7 miles from the parish line according to my trip odometer, 2.7 miles and 8.2 miles, respectively, to a great junior high and high school that my lady and I both pass on our way to work and back home...
But going to school in our district means a two hour bus ride for the kids to schools that are falling apart, have failing ratings, and one has a bullet hole in the main entrance door.

Three vacation days to cross the river, so to speak. It's all done but one signature.
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TWBryan

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Re: First experience with braid, mixed feelings, fun read
« Reply #39 on: August 15, 2017, 03:18:20 PM »

Man that's terrible,no way you could write the school board and get them to consider moving your kids to a better school? Seems a raw deal to me.

Pulled apart 4600 and sat down and have been polishing the heck out of the parts. The pinion gear is pretty rough. I did what I could with it. Polished drag washers,worked on main brass gear,but it looks like a Monday morning,Friday afternoon part. Polished inside of brake drum too. Polished axle ends as best I could. Put all the small parts in a pill bottle filled  with goo-gone I keep on the inside workbench. It takes a while to work,but by morning those parts should be clean.

Hoping to finish it up tomorrow.
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SteelHorseCowboy

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Re: First experience with braid, mixed feelings, fun read
« Reply #40 on: August 15, 2017, 08:15:06 PM »

Man, you're going a bit further into it than I did!

And the school thing is pretty much worked out. The last hurdle is for our school district's superintendent's release letter. It's already been written and emailed to the district superintendent over the schools we're sending them to. It just hasn't quite made the rounds to all the appropriate parties yet, the asst. superintendent and principals, but since it's made it from one head honcho to the other, they start tomorrow at the good schools that I could see from my front porch if trees weren't in the way, rather than the failing schools over 30 miles away.
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TWBryan

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Re: First experience with braid, mixed feelings, fun read
« Reply #41 on: August 16, 2017, 10:01:19 AM »

Steelhorse,that's great news about the kid's schools. :)

Finished up 4600c4 this morning cleaned and lubed parts and took it out in the narrow backyard. I can only practice overhead casting it's that narrow.Got the adjustments made and practiced casting a 3/8 oz lead weight. First thing I noticed was that the retrieval was smoother feeling,easier. In casting I think I gained roughly 5 feet of distance,the reel makes a "whir" sound as it goes out. I'm pleased with the results.

Now the weird part, as I was casting I noticed one of our cats in the screen room next to me,was following the retrieved weight with great interest. I thought well it's got his attention at least. About three more casts and a hawk flew out from behind the house and landed nearly on top of the lead weight. Don't know what kind of hawk ,but we see them frequently.

I told the hawk that was looking around for the prey, "That's not for you." It took off.. Yeah,believe it or not. :)

The reel polish was a great success,so I might grab the "backup" 4600 and start working on it. 
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SteelHorseCowboy

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Re: First experience with braid, mixed feelings, fun read
« Reply #42 on: August 17, 2017, 09:06:43 AM »

Lol, I had a Mockingbird come check out a weight a was tossing while I was test casting this old squeaky Daiwa I've had laying around.

The situation with that reel REALLY sucks! I love the way it casts and retrieves and it has a flippin switch. Not sure how I'm supposed to work that feature yet. I notice when it's on, the thumb bar release automatically pops up when you let go, rather than waiting until you start reeling.
But no matter where I apply lube, I can't silence that freaking squeak! I even laid out all the parts and just hosed them down with Ballistol, and it didn't make the slightest bit of difference!
It only squeaks when retrieving, and while I was writing all of that I realized I may have neglected lubing the handle knobs.

*facepalm*
Ugh. I'll check on that this evening.
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TWBryan

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Re: First experience with braid, mixed feelings, fun read
« Reply #43 on: August 17, 2017, 10:20:19 AM »

Steelhorse,Ain't that always the case? The little things that you overlook. :) I had the same issue and finally figured it out...

Well,the 2nd 4600 was not a great success,but I figure after I add the dual bearing levelwind and idler gear it might smooth up some.

Considering doing the polishing on my 5500c3 this afternoon. Trying to finish up a kydex holster jig for my 6" gp1oo at the moment. Should not take much longer...

What kind of Daiwa is it? Plenty of people here seem to like Daiwa's ,might be worth putting money in. :)
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SteelHorseCowboy

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Re: First experience with braid, mixed feelings, fun read
« Reply #44 on: August 17, 2017, 12:26:05 PM »

A Pr1-2bi. I think it's the predecessor to the procaster, or a budget model based on the procaster? Not sure, can't seem to find very much info on it.
It's ugly as hell, but I care more about function. The only thing wrong with it is some of the markings are rubbed off, and that blamin squeak!
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TWBryan

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Re: First experience with braid, mixed feelings, fun read
« Reply #45 on: August 17, 2017, 02:58:26 PM »

Function is beauty as far as this old dimwit is concerned. I'll never understand the people who want to color coordinate their rod and reel,and they will never understand me.

As to the Daiwa reel,would this be it?

http://www.daiwa.com/us/service/manuals/image/baitcasting/PR1-2BI_5BI.pdf

Mike's reels has some info-

http://www.mikesreelrepair.com/daiwa-pr1-5bi2c-pr1-2bi/

Worked all afternoon on 5500c3,just about done. I'm soaking the second sideplate bearing ,in a minute or two I'll fish it out of the pill bottle and let it dry for a while. UPS on the job and they delivered reel butter on my doorstep. If I get a chance I'll report on it.

Also waiting on new dryer to be delivered,probably delayed due to rain..

I'm suppposed to have polished the ends of the spool axle. Yet to find one of these axles that doesn't have a dent or divot on the ends so you can't polish them. The 5500c has a hole in one end of the axle.  :(



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SteelHorseCowboy

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Re: First experience with braid, mixed feelings, fun read
« Reply #46 on: August 17, 2017, 06:35:17 PM »

Yep, that's the exact same reel. And guess what? Fixed that dang squeak! I put a single drop of oil in each knob and it's gone. I've got it on a rod, test drove it a little with 3/16oz and 1/4oz weights. Gonna try it out first chance I get with a weightless Dinger.

On all the reels I have that have bearings in the side plates, the very ends of the spindles don't actually ride in the bearings, there's usually about 1/8" exposed outside of the bearings.
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TWBryan

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Re: First experience with braid, mixed feelings, fun read
« Reply #47 on: August 17, 2017, 06:51:33 PM »

The problem is they set against the endcap that adjusts spool tension. If I could polish those areas I would have better results in adjusting the spool tension,a little less friction in those areas would give me a more "gradual tension control" and a bit of leeway there. I'm sure the difference isn't much,but every bit counts.

Finished up 5500c3 ,but it feels like something is dragging,so I'll go back into it tomorrow and find out where I screwed up. ;)

Glad to hear you got rid of the squeak. Nice to be able to toss light weights like that with a baitcaster. Someday I'll get my hands on a modern reel... 
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SteelHorseCowboy

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Re: First experience with braid, mixed feelings, fun read
« Reply #48 on: August 18, 2017, 09:12:17 AM »

If you're wanting to polish the very tips of the spindles where they contact the shim inside the knobs, try applying Flitz to a piece of leather and just running the tip back and forth. Or, this is one area you COULD use a power tool on. Same Flitz and leather combo, but chuck the part in a drill, GENTLY, and spin it at low speed until you get the result you're looking for. I've done this with plunger type ejectors in rifles before polishing the outer diameter of the same using the vise clamp method I mentioned earlier, as well as a q-tip/flitz/drill combo for the ejector hole (toothpick or pipe cleaner if I can't fit a q-tip in there). That, plus a fresh spring, are always a sure fix for sticky ejectors. I've also done it with sticky revolver chambers, using a bore mop coated in flitz.

If you use that method, do NOT apply pressure and DO keep the speed low.
I was reupholstering a leather chair, and thankfully all I was polishing were the heads of some long and heavy duty tacks, just to make 'em look prettier. All I could find for the project with the shaft I needed had "antiqued" dome heads. I went high speed, moderate pressure, and as soon as I tilted the drill to polish more of the domed head on the first tack, that sucker bent, gouged my homemade bench strop, and the head went flying.
The spool spindle is steel, but it's also long compared to an upholstery tack so I'm sure it can get trashed pretty easily if you get careless. With that kind of length, possibly even more easily than an upholstery tack.
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TWBryan

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Re: First experience with braid, mixed feelings, fun read
« Reply #49 on: August 18, 2017, 11:08:11 AM »

Steelhorse,that's a great idea ,I might just do that ,rather than doing it by hand like I have been doing. I'll try it on the 5500c3 this afternoon and see how it goes.  :)

Feeling tempted by a Fenwick rod,but don't know much about them.  :-\
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